Regardless, I except for old or weak applications, I don't know why you would WANT to run triple screen without 2 cards (something like LFS is an exception though, not the rule). You're not going to run that Geralt avatar of yours around at max detail on 3 screens with ANY video card!

Why is eyefinity better than nvidia surround?

AMD's "solution" for 3D also leaves a lot to be desired, but 3D vision and 3DTV Play, whilst not always perfect, are ahead of anything else around right now and have been for a long time.

Haha, yeah.

Listen, I defended iRacing in the past because I believed it could/was going somewhere. But it's been a long time and nothing groundbreaking has gone on over there I don't really know what they do with all that money, but it doesn't seem to be used for researching implementing useful things (not that content isn't useful, but at some point having a better SIM should become a priority???). I was even accused of being a rabid fanboy (much) earlier in this very thread!

But I find it downright comical that even an iR supporter could say that... It's "the best thing going in simracing" and you can't even stall a car! :doh:

It's hard to believe it could happen, but I'm starting to think that RF2's tire model is actually more accurate than that in iRacing. One thing's for sure, it's definitely more advanced in terms of feature set. And the sim itself is of course more advanced in terms of features...

Silly. They're not "charging for a beta", they're charging for a finished product, and LETTING you play the beta for forking out the dough early.

Quote from MAGGOT :

Can anyone explain the pay options?

1) Pay
2) Don't pay



Seriously though it's like $18/year for online so...

Anyway, if you buy it now you don't have to worry about it for 1.5 years.

Last edited by Ball Bearing Turbo, Thu 19 Jan 2012, 00:31.

Well, I'm not so sure that that area is a problem:

There is one thing I notice that DOES NOT happen in any other sim I've tried, and I know I talked with Bob Smith about it regarding LFS a few years ago.

in Rfactor 2, when at a standstill, if you turn the wheel a little bit and let it go, it actually snaps back just a little bit - EXACTLY like it should, just like in real life because you're applying torsion to the contact patch. You can feel the tire distorting and resisting the turn, and then forcing the steering back a few degrees as the contact patch re-aligns.

LFS does not do this. iRacing does not do this. nKPro does not do this.

I'm also not sure how you would observe harmonics in a real time video like that or maybe I'm not understanding what you're saying there?

Mhmm... huge jet shadow flew across the track at T1 Mills during a session the other night, kind of caught me off guard... nice little addition though, I guess there can be distractions to deal with in real racing

Quote from PMD9409 :

I never knew a Honda CrapBox could ever look so good/fun.

Yeah I was scoffing and mocking until I started seeing the tires do their thing :rolleyes: Then I was like :jawdrop:

Quote :

It isn't always the same line. Start the track wet and drive (by yourself, not with AIs!) the wrong line on purpose, you will definitely see it isn't the same line over and over. This works for drying the track and for rubber build up.

Picture below shows the rubber build up. That's 15 laps running a high line and notice how it has rubbered up and the low line has not.

http://i.imgur.com/rksV9.jpg

... WTF, what are you driving, and where is that?

Well, someone made a Mod and posted a video. If anyone here takes tires seriously, watch this video of the guy messing around.

Lateral deformation is working, Vertical deformation is working, as is visible flatspotting etc. At one point a little over halfway through, video is shown from below the road surface (LOL) but it REALLY shows the detail in this tire model since the track is transparent, you can see the contact patch of the tire shifting and morphing with load, melting during lockups etc... The deformation isn't as exaggerated (?) as LFS, it looks pretty natural in all directions. I like it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v ... ISXU&feature=youtu.be

Quote from BlueFlame :

Does anyone have any tips for FPS framerate issues. I have everything on low, gfx drivers updated but still get laggy rates which make it very tedious.

Anyone know of any config settings or such to help with FPS issues? Searched everywhere online for help but can't find anything other than the usual (update gfx drivers and put everything on low) and other stuff that I have already tried.

What are your machine specs and what sort of FPS are you currently getting?

Quote from Hyperactive :

I have not even noticed that the tires pick dirt and lose grip when you drive off the track. The sounds of the gravel throwing around under the car and hitting the bottom of the car is nice but I never felt any grip being lost

Heh, I'm starting to think you're playing a different sim

The dirty tires are real obvious when a turn you normally take at full throttle, only after bouncing through some dirt on the previous turn the same approach sends me washing out like a dolt... like I said you can really feel it in the wheel too, the tires desperately trying to do something - it actually does a great job of communicating that the tires actually have gravel/dirt impressed into the tread (not sure if that's actually modeled that way, but that's what it SHOULD feel like regardless)

Quote from PMD9409 :

That's the one huge change from rF1 to rF2, you can drift the Megane and F1 quite easily.

Indeed. At first I reacted like Jamie did on my first few laps, but then as I said on all my other posts I discovered that isn't really the case at all. I probably can't even race the F1 properly now, I think I've trained myself badly to drive it like a psycho because it's just too fun to take seriously.

Quote :

The F3.5 is nimble and shouldn't be able to be drifted, however most slides in it are still recoverable unless you get the momentum to make it snap.

Is that really true? Is the car comparable to the FOX in LFS spec wise? I kind of thought any car "should" be able to be drifted so the complaints about the car had me a bit worried.

Last edited by Ball Bearing Turbo, Mon 16 Jan 2012, 00:05.

Yeah I knew the racing line had more grip, I didn't know marbling was modeled (IE a zone just outside the racing line actually having less grip than bare tarmac because of the marbles) That's good to know.

The more I run it the more I like it. I'm actually wondering if the intermittent inability to catch the Megane has to do with the fact that the used portion of the track has so much more grip... I haven't read whether or not marbles are involved yet, but listen up:

I noticed last night, coming into one of the tight first gear turns at the Malaysia track, that I actually unintentionally rotated the car into the turn very quickly and initiated a four wheel slide by having the inside tires in the rubberized portion of track and the outside wheels outside that zone. The inside had wheel more grip and the outside started to lock up and try to keep going. So, if you kick the back end out and and it leaves "the zone", I think maybe that could explain the odd time when for some reason the car just doesn't feel like recovering - whereas if I actually PLAN the slide, I never have a problem! That's because I slide it through the racing line I think. I don't know, just a thought? I'm not saying the tires are perfect because I don't know and haven't done any actual testing... Maybe Todd will have something to say some time.

Also, I LOVE how I can feel when there's dirt in the tires! After an off, I can feel very obviously in the next turns the front end struggling and skitting along the track, gradually regaining max traction, it's really really a nice feeling. I think the FFB seems to be extremely well done, color me impressed! The tires also seem to actually dig in a bit on grass, it doesn't just feel like a solid surface that has no grip like other sims.

Also, this is the first sim that I do not have trouble with curbing... I have issues in LFS, iRacing, and NK PRO when putting a wheel up on curbs, it just never behaved like I thought it should... other guys can do it fine, sure, but I was never convinced that the technique they used was realistic. in RF2, they have a little less grip but touching them doesn't cause an over reaction like other sims.

Quote from Hyperactive :

With the megane the last corner at Mills is a nice example. It is basically a slow 3rd gear corner where you want to to get on throttle as early as possible. With the megane when I try to do that (online, after driving 10 laps on a server with 20 people) it is just so easy to get on power and unexpectedly lose the rear of the car which just sends the car into spin that can not be stopped (nakajima).

Here's the thing, try initially giving 85% throttle and working up to 100% as you "feel there's room for more torque" instead of full boar right off the bat. When I started doing that, I stopped having that problem. I will agree that in that car if you don't PLAN a high yaw angle out of the turn, it can catch you for sure and like you say it won't come back easy. I'm not sure if that's a problem with the tire model or not, since the F1 doesn't act that way and is much easier to "fool around" with. It's a weird car though too, super short wheelbase and mid engine... Like you kind of say, I'd expect it to have the characteristics it has but maybe it's too severe, I don't know for sure. I think it's pretty fun though, and that "limit" zone you describe is, IMO, much much MUCH wider than any other ISI product to date so the least I could say is that they're definitely going the right way.

Here's some snippets from the knownissues.txt file in the RF2 folder:

Tire Model
==========
-Contact patch load distribution model is not final, which means tire pressure does not have the full effect that it should.
-Aquaplaning is not implemented, so wet weather driving is only properly modelled when the track is damp but with no standing water.
-Wear (meaning both abrasion and degradation) is incomplete in several aspects.
-There are other relatively minor loose ends.
-Curbs, white lines have almost no grip in rain

Collision
=========
-Loose objects (cones, haybales, etc.) "fall asleep" inappropriately, sometimes up in the air, and essentially turn into solid objects.
-Sometimes intense collisions cause the simulation to fall out of realtime, which is very unpleasant. This is usually caused when objects manage to get partly inside each other, which unfortunately happens more often in multiplayer due to imperfect prediction.

Weather/RealRoad
================
-Groove build-up and track wetness/drying happen at an artificial, accelerated rate.
-Wind and humidity do nothing.

Quote :

Could be my crap driving skills too. I can't really feel the cars in rf2 which is probably one reason why the driving feels so hard.

I remember running you in LFS, your skills were definitely not crap at least back then . Kind of wondering why you're not feeling the cars??

Quote from Hyperactive :

I think the fault is in the longnitudal grip curves simply because when you get power oversteer you can not control it by throttle but only by steering.

See, this I don't totally agree with. What I WOULD say is that currently very little throttle is required to accomplish the same adjustment you would get in say LFS.

Especially in the F1s, I can feather all the way through a turn using only throttle steer, but when I first tried I would lose it way too often. Now, I can do exactly what I want by throttle steering but the throttle input is quite a bit less than I'm used to from LFS... Seems that the force combining could be more sensitive, or just the engine response to throttle input, engine inertia or who knows what - bottom line is that it's more sensitive for some reason.

Even out of low speed turns I can put the F1s at normal angle with neutral steer, or just Tiff Needel it around the corner if the mood strikes me (sorry, trying to keep up with your name dropping )

I kind of get what you're saying in some regards on the other aspects though.

Right then, clearly my math was moronic

OK...

Well, last night I had some issues with dreadful framerates. First I had to disable SLI, and it went up some. 3D also would not engage with SLI turned on, so I was running one card in 3D with still rather piss poor performance (on medium settings). But 3D looks good at least. Then today I had the brainwave to try disabling the 3D Vision altogether along with SLI and PRESTO... Every single setting maxed out and liquid smooth. This lends itself to a much more fair evaluation:

I think it is a great product, and I am glad I bought it and look foward to seeing it grow. The Megane (sp?) is really nice to drive. At first I thought (like Hyper said) that there was the typical ISI uncatchable slide thing but the more I drive it the more I see it's really light years ahead of the original. I can drift the Megane rather easily which is a good sign, but it sure isn't the fastest way to go that's for sure. The FFB is very good also (on the road at least).

I couldn't wipe the grin off my face though once I got into that crazyass deathtrap, the F1B from 1968 - who would've thought an old V8 with a seat in front could be so fun? You can throw the thing around like a dodgeball if you really want to, powersliding all over hell and it's really fun until the tires give up on you But keeping it under control at any sort of speed is actually rather terrifying. Shit, going fast in a straight line is dodgy in that thing and it's damn fun!

Lateral slip angle tolerance (anecdote - I did not scientifically test this) is somewhere between LFS and iRacing, which is probably why I was a bit hesitant at first. I am used to LFS' massive tolerance this way and although I think it's closer to real than iRacing, I still think the yaw angles that are quick in LFS are pretty high sometimes, but I digress. I've been playing quite a bit of offline LFS before RF2 came out so I think that I needed more than an hour at low FPS to really make a comparison.

I'm actually pretty impressed with RF2, much more than I expected to be.

I haven't tried the modern formula car out yet since I don't really care for the type of vehicle in sims.

You're an evil, evil man....

Quote from atledreier :

It's a matter of FOV alone. In my setting I can have EITHER wide FOV (eyefinity, 130deg FOV) OR 3D (projector, 85deg fov). I greatly prefer a wide FOV over 3D. If I could have both I'd take it.

Image size has nothing to do with this. A huge screen seen from farther away can have alot less FOV than a small display up close. Also, the triplescreen display give you some 'free' FOV since the side screens are at an angle.

Honestly I think the bezels would ruin it for me, that's why I never got a surround set up. I tried Eyefinity at the local shop and the bezels just pissed me off so much I couldn't stand it.

What 3D solution are you using - tridef? DDD? Which projector? I had it worked out that I could get a 115 degree FOV with a projector, and the size being basically the same as real life was something I was looking forward to...

I'm 50/50 on the physics, which is actually pretty good. It has a nice feel to it but it's not as predictable as it should be yet. I'd be inclined to say that it feels better than iRacing though which is sort of funny (though I haven't driven the iR NTM on anything other than the FGT). I really really like the feature-set of the tire model and track physics though, and it's actually really encouraging that the beta is this good. They also have a number of tire model notes in the readme file that shows it's still heavily a WIP, along with a decent list of other things. All indications point to having a pretty nice sim this summer once things are more finalized, and the modders have gone to town - no buyers remorse here!

No you just have to buy rFactor 2 for $45, and you get the Beta.

As you said, TH8, nVidia Surround requires an SLI setup. Though it'd probably work fine for LFS; any modern game would choke with any amount of eyecandy on a 3 monitor setup anyway.

Downloading....

That's the route I'm planning to go, I just want to see it first with my own eyes. Everyone on the nVidia forums who has a projector raves about it, I think even Shotglass here likes projectors if memory serves me right. Plus it takes a lot less GPU power - it's already dodgy rendering twice as many frames (one for each eye), you'd need a serious beast to run 3 monitors in 3D. No question, a projector/3D setup would be superior to a triple 2D setup for immersion IMO. The extra dimension adds more than I ever thought it would.

Also, there is no cross-talk when using a projector. I do get a bit on my monitor near the top/bottom if there is highly contrasted objects sometimes.

Wish I could say that about LFS & S3.... Clearly humans are insufferable wretched beasts no matter what bone we're thrown? Sept 2011? Great, come back in 8 years and see if you're psyched to mock a different company that at least publishes it's intentions.

Quote from jtw62074 :

LFS handles this area better than any other sim I'm aware of, besides my own and two others that friends have made that aren't public. The original Hard Drivin' back in the 80's didn't have this problem either, because Doug Milliken knew what tire force curves looked like out in the slidey area when he made it. This was way before GPL.

:jawdrop:

Hard Drivin' was what I cut "sim racing teeth" on. I used to get to that arcade as much as I could to mess with that game when I was very young (dating myself a bit?). I can't believe you even have connections to that game, that's awesome!

I enjoyed Race Drivin' the sequel equally so; getting that corkskrew done right on the stunt track was an accomplishment. Would be fun to get ahold of either game for a keepsake one say. Odd thing is they were never lined up , such is the life of a simracer I guess